By Ale Natiq
Cross-Posted from Ale’s blog (Thanks to Pakistani intelligence agencies for their illegal Denial of Service (DOS) attacks on Ale’s blog)
Religion has quite frequently been used as an excuse for military motives. Talking specifically about Islam, hadees has been used as a tool to invent excuses for political motivations and military interventions/attacks as and when required.
There has been enormous hue and cry over Ghazwa-tul-Hind for years. This was probably first used by self-styled Jihadi activists in Pakistan for getting public support in Pakistan and raising funds to be used in their attacks in Kashmir with the aim of conquering India and creating what they call dar-ul-Islam. It is very interesting to note that neither Arabs nor the Mujahideen of Afghanistan made use of these ahadees to wage a war against India. Pakistan Army, ISI and the local Jihadis have a monopoly over Ghazwa-tul-Hind for now, although they don’t talk specifically about Green Pakistani Jihadis waging the war.
Islamists and right-wing-military-apologists have fallen to the propaganda of Pakistan Army and ISI when they propagate waging a war against the neighboring country India, finding excuses for ding so through hadees. Zaid Hamid, the mouth-piece of ISI and Pakistan Army has been making use of Ghazwa-tul-Hind (6 hadees in total), promoting hatred against Hindus and war hysteria. These hadees are available here.
Are they authentic ?
- Just a brief look at these will make it clear that none of these five ahadees are found in Sihah-e-Sitta. Two of these appear to be in the collections of ahadees by Imam Nisai but not in Sunan an-Nisai al Sughra, the book considered to be among the Sihah-e-Sitta, the six books considered most reliable by main-stream Muslims.
- The others are not even found in the reliable collections of respected muhadiseen.
- Note that Imam Nisai died in 915. The years of death of other respected muhadiseen to whom Sihah-e-Sitta are attributed to: Imam Bukhari in 870, Imam Muslim in 875, Abu Daud in 888, al-Tirmizi in 892, Imam Malik in 796, Ibn Maja in 886. All of them died before Imam Nisai. It does not make much sense that we have these ahadees being narrated through Imam Nisai but not through any of the other respected muhadiseen who lived before him.
- They are narrated through a single chain. Reported only once through one companion of the Prophet.
- Considering the reward for participating in this war and the importance of it, as these ahadees tell, they should have been narrated by more companions of the Prophet and should have been there in more books of ahadees.
- It is very important to note that none of these are found in any of the collections of ahadees which the Shia Muslims consider authentic. This raises the question if they were invented by the Ummayads/Abbasids considering their expansionist designs? This is also to be noted that Ummayads did reach Sindh, a part of Hind back then.
- One must also note the fact that we don’t have any history report telling us about the use of these ahadees in the past by Muslim rulers or conquerors, even those who did invade India or waged a war on it. If they were respected and authentic ahadees, we should have such history reports.
Fourthly, it must be remembered that it would have been very easy for Muslim conquerors of India in the past, men like Mahmud of Ghazni, Shihabuddin Ghori, Timur, Nadir Shah and so on, to present the hadith about the ghazwat ul-hind and wield it as a weapon to justify their attacks on the country. The corrupt ulema associated with their courts could well have suggested this to them had they wished. However, no such mention is made about this in history books. In the eighteenth century, the well-known Islamic scholar Shah Waliullah of Delhi invited the Afghan warlord Ahmad Shah Abdali to invade India and dispel the Marathas, which he accepted, but yet Shah Waliullah, too, did not use this hadith as a pretext for this. [1]
What if they are authentic ?
It is also pertinent to examine how some well-known contemporary Indian ulema look at this hadith report.
- Maulana Abdul Hamid Numani, a leading figure of the Jamiat ul-Ulema-i Hind, opines that this hadith was fulfilled at the time of the ‘Four Righteous Caliphs’ of the Sunnis, soon after the demise of the Prophet Muhammad, when several companions of the Prophet came to India, mainly in order to spread Islam. [1]
- Mufti Sajid Qasmi, who teaches at the Dar ul-Uloom in Deoband, is also of the same opinion, although he believes that it might also refer to the invasion of Sindh by the Arabs under Muhammad bin Qasim in the eighth century. [1]
- On the other hand, Maulana Mufti Mushtaq Tijarvi of the Jamaat-i Islami Hind believes that it is possible that this hadith report is not genuine at all and that it might have been fabricated at the time of Muhammad bin Qasim’s invasion of Sindh in order to justify it. [1]
- On the other hand, if this hadith report is indeed genuine—which it might well be—in my view, the battle against India that it predicted was fulfilled in the early Islamic period itself, and is not something that will happen in the future. This, in fact, is the opinion of the majority of the ulema, qualified Islamic scholars. And this view accords with reason as well. [1]
- It is quite likely that the ghazwat ul-hind that this report predicted took the form of the attack by an Arab Muslim force on Thana and Bharuch, in coastal western India , in the 15th year or the Islamic calendar in the reign of the Caliph Umar. [1]
- Equally possibly, it could have been fulfilled in the form of the missionary efforts of some of the Prophet’s companions soon after, in the reign of the Caliphs Uthman and Ali, in Sindh and Gujarat .[1]
- Some other ulema consider this hadith to have been fulfilled in the form of the attack and occupation of Sindh by Arab Muslims led by Muhammad bin Qasim in the 93rd year of the Islamic calendar, which then facilitated the spread of Islam in the country. [1]
- This might well be the case, for the hadith report about the ghazwat ul-hind contained in the Masnad of Ahmad ibn Hanbal, a well-known collection of Hadith narratives attributed to the Prophet, mentions that the Muslim army that would attack India would be sent in the direction of Sindh and Hind. [1]
Opinion of the religious scholars
I inquired about the authenticity of these ahadees from a few religious scholars and would like to share their opinion in this regard:
Such things exist in the hadith collections, which are often either placed or mounted on a symbolic meaning, or they talk about something historic which has happened in the context of what we believe in self-defense. Further, the hadith in question can be doubted about their autenticity as they are not found in any reliable and agreed upon source. The chain of narrators is weak to be considered authentic.In this day and age what would govern the relations of Muslims and followers of other religions, are the international treaties and covenants that ensure the state security, peace and freedom of belief for all human beings.These treaties are binding on Muslims, especially as they are consistent with the approach of Islam declared in the Qur’an about the obligation to respect the religions and the freedom and security of other peoples.Hence, the use of such hadith for political or military motives is discouraged.The Office of the referenda for Religious AuthorityGrand Ayatollah Mohammed Hussein Fadlallah
Research Wing, Al-Mawrid Institue
assalaam o alaykumI have tried to find out the sources of these traditions. None of these traditions is found in reliable soruces like Bukhari, Muslim, Mu’atta etc. If we suppose them to be reliable they talk about an even that has happened already. They do not talk about Pakistanis fighting Indians. They talk about Arabs on an expedition to India and conquering it.Tariq Mahmood HashmiAssociate Editor
SalaamAll these ahadith refer to troops going from Palestine and Syria and returning to those regions. Even if these ahadith were authentic, and they are indeed found in reliable books, they have nothing to do with any possibility of an Indo-Pak war.The other important thing to note is that Abu Huraira, the companion-narrator is suggesting that it was something that was about to happen during his lifetime. it is quite likely that Muhammad Bin Qasim’s conquest of Sind was being prophesied in these ahadith.
The third important matter to note is that a message as important as the one mentioned in these narratives is described in all different versions through only one companion. Clearly, if the message was important, there should have been several narrators mentioning it.
This message therefore cannot be employed as an excuse to fight against India. We can fight against India or any other nation only if conditions of Jihad are satisfied, which are: it should be declared by a Muslim ruler, Muslims should be at least half as militarily strong as their enemies, and the enemy should be guilty of blatant injustice against a group of people. Any individual or group of people cannot declare Jihad on their own against anyone; if they do, they will be guilty of creating fasaad fil ‘ard (mischief on earth). [2]
Information on the ahadees available at http://www.ghazwatulhind.com/
Umar
December 7, 2009
A very well written article, I always doubted its authenticity myself. I wonder why no one in the media comes forward and shuts up Hamid Mir and company who constantly refer to it! =)
Umar
December 7, 2009
…oh or wait, was it Zaid Hamid? Ah well, both of them are the same…responsible for creating panic among the masses and making them lose focus from what really is the core problem in our country, religious hijacking and blind faith by illiterate people who never had the motivation to actually open up the Quran and Hadith and research about the truth themselves…
Nauman
December 8, 2009
Assalam O Alaikum My all friends.
I found this article really interesting. Appreciate someone who has written it.
For the answers of all your questions, why don’t you ask Zaid Hamid straight away? He has answered all these questions so many times. Just go on youtube and watch a few clips of Zaid Hamid. If you can’t then I can make you clear.
These Ahadith are not for the past, they are for the future and their is a Hadith saying “There will be troops coming to capture Hind and then they will go and meet Moosa (Jesus).”
From this Hadith we can’t deny of it being a past thing. As far as somebody from Lahore said that Abu-Huraira thought that it will be in his lifetime doesn’t say anything about it being already happened. He simply got excited that’s it. And why are you missing a point here that Abu Huraira said “Sayyidi! If I find Jesus after this should I tell him that I am your companion?, Our beloved prophet said ‘It’s very difficult for you to see it'”
We believe that we will rise again. God didn’t make Pakistan without purpose. It’s name means Madina Tayyaba. It is made on Friday, 27th of Ramzan. What else you need to admit its importance?
Pakistan Zindabaad
Bin Ismail
February 11, 2010
Why limit the statement to just Pakistan ? God didn’t make this World without purpose – and the purpose obviously was not hatred and bloodshed.
Umar
December 8, 2009
Yes, but the point is that these Hadith do not exist in the Sihah-e-Sitta, any hadith referred outside of that, is something I would take with a grain of salt.
Razia
December 18, 2009
Nauman, when is this invasion of India going to happen? Will it be before or after Pakistan implodes? Are you blind? Can you not see the brave fight the Pakistani Army is waging against the Taliban for the soul of our country? Do you know how many people died to make Pakistan a reality? We should stop thinking of enslaving Hindus and start thinking about putting our house in order.
Bin Ismail
February 11, 2010
Well said
S.Ganesh Kumar
December 18, 2009
Interesting article
Tilsim
December 23, 2009
Nauman, being a fellow Muslim, I think the present and future will be decided by our wisdom, good deeds and actions and not through the abandonment of truth, justice and humility nor intolerance and threats to neighbours. As Muslims, we have to guard against imbalance and should not use religious arguments to further immoral, unlawful and unethical aims. Otherwise this religion becomes just a standard bearer for ego-centric tribal agendas. Zaid Hamid is doing Islam and Pakistan no favours. Religious texts have been used by people of all religions with evil intentions. I would humbly suggest that you inwardly reflect on whether your thoughts and deeds meet the highest standards set by Allah, the knower of our innermost thoughts.
ASQ
December 23, 2009
AoA
Its very easy for ppl to believe in CNN, BBC and all secular stuff that is totally non-islamic and also its very easy for most of ppl to digest rabba economy by saying its profit !! Haan easy isn’t it? its easy for you to call ppl in Kashmir terrorists? ppl in Palestine terrorist? ppl in Afghanistan terrorist? Go and check out what they do to your sisters? your mothers? your brothers? Dont just close your eyes!! check out history how they destroyed Ottoman Empire! Go! then you will know the fake systems like democracy, secularism etc etc junk.
And you will know they always convince you ending up blaming your own self and praising them! see real picture not just TV.
KNOW YOUR SELF AND KNOW YOUR ENEMY! and Enemy will never change.
And if you can believe Christians and hindus, stop !
start believing your self first. Start reading Quran and start obeying its orders and stop fighting on blaming others especially who are trying to unite you MUSLIMS! and stop being impressed with democracy or other systems which are already proven to be fake!!
THE LAST SYSTEM AND LAST CONSTITUTION IS SYSTEM OF ALLAH AND SYSTEM DEFINED BY QURAN! THATS IT! BELIEVE OR LEAVE!
I hope atleast few ppl will start researching what they did to us in WW1 and WW2
Thank you
AH
ASQ
December 23, 2009
AoA
check out these
http://www.wakeupproject.com/
http://www.tariqjamil.org/Forum/ad-deen-u-naseeha/hadiths-on-ghazwa-e-hind/
this is little data research yourself!! there is more data !!
AH
ASQ
December 24, 2009
first of all there is no such word as “Ghazwa-tul-Hind” its “Ghazwa-e-hind” as tul is not present in arabic ! oki
and second……. few references are as follows
http://www.tariqjamil.org/Forum/ad-deen-u-naseeha/hadiths-on-ghazwa-e-hind/
believe it or not its gona happen ” THE ALLAH’S SYSTEM WILL BE ESTABLISHED ON THIS EARTH SOON” its your choice to be part of it or against it! make your choices!
gk
January 21, 2010
Are you sure, what you people are talking about. Does Allah wrote in the Quran to kill all the Hindus and Christians?
But why does he hate us?
I did not do any mistake. I love all religions.
boxhead
January 22, 2010
lil ‘innocent’ gk .. nobody here is talking about killing hindus and christians or anyone else for that matter. I wont say Much about this, cuz alot has already been discussed. as for you loving all religions, thats excellent. Muslims believe in living in peace among all other religions. If you dont know about that, read muslims history.
By the way, you cant possibly be this innocent, as your reply seems rather ”cunning” to me. (some ppl think, we’r really that stupid lol :d)
indian
January 27, 2010
I see…So this hadis is not authentic…pheww…big relief there — just imagine if it had been authentic — then you would be the first one off on a horse shouting for jihad no?
The premise of your argument, friend, is flawed.
Ghazwa-e-Hind is not flawed because the Hadis is misqouted — it is wrong because it goes against the basic grain of humanity.
Doing the right thing for the wrong reason is even worse than doing the wrong thing for the wrong reason.
Kiani
January 29, 2010
Pakistan is a country that has long been hijacked on the name of Democracy. And as I believe this Hadith to be true, Pakistan will rise again !
Pakistan is the First Muslim Nuclear Power in the World ! We cannot manufacture a Sewing Needle but we can manufacture Nuclear Weapons ! I believe that Allah gave this power to Pakistan only Because it gave us a Special Mission ! And the significance of this can be seen from the fact that our country’s name is ‘Pak-istan’ meaning Madina Sani ! And our country was born on the Blessed 27th Ramadan. This is not a Co-incidence !
Pakistan ka Matlab Kiya : La Ilaha IlaAllah
Pakistan Ka Maqsad Kiya : Mohammad-ur-Rasool Allah
Pakistan Zindabaad ! Allah O Akbar !
Shabbir Alam
September 10, 2014
ha ha ha ha ! lekin paye , ye kon sa madina sani hai jahan, sharab bikti hai, auraton ka dhandha hota hai, masjidon me bomb fute hain..jahan musalman nahi , muhajir , pathan , balochi aur pathan tahte hain, bat to musalmano ke rahne ki hui thi…usi madina ki veena malik nangi photos khinchati hai…sharam tum ko magar nahi aati….lanat hai
Justin
February 3, 2010
lol, that was funny. It is interesting to see that pakistanis are still stuck in bronze age stories when men had yet to learn that diseases are caused by germs and not due to the wrath of their deity.
Justin
February 3, 2010
Dear Mr. Kiani, that was a nice piece of rant. I wonder if you are able to see the dicotomy in what you yourself accepted, that Pakistan can’t even manufacture a sewing needle. I mean if you can’t manufacture a sewing needle or have any kind of industry to boast of, it is higly and incredibly unlikely that you could have manufactured that “Islamic Bomb” (sigh!) of yours.
For once try to use your rational thinking, if you have any of your rational faculaties still in place. The whole world knows how you got those nukes and still you are in a state of denial.
We Indians are busy aquiring global buisnesses houses like Arcelor, Jaguar, Mercedes and investing heavily in growth and infrastructure while you are still busy exploring and propagating your bronze age myths and fables.
By the way it was China and not Allah who gave you that nukes, you should atleast have the right sense of gratitude.
Justin
February 3, 2010
Funny that this website is called Secular pakistan and yet has a page dedicated to discussing whether some bronze age myth is true or not. I mean cmmon, if that is how secular educated Pakistanis think then what hope can you have from the semi-literate and illiterate Pakistanis.
Justin
February 3, 2010
Well, ASQ, CNN, BBC and other secular media houses can provide objective proofs for their hypothesis, conclusions and reporting thereof. Can you provide a single objective proof for the authenticity of your Hadees and the Quran?
As for the destruction of the Ottoman Empire, do you need futher proof that your allah does not exist and if he does he does not give a hoot about all you pious allah fearing Muslims? I mean your people were humilaited and are still being humilaited because of your barbarism and midveal beliefs and pratices. Till the time you don’t pull yourselves together and start behaving like mamals who belong to the twenty first century you will continue being the laughing stock of the world and humanity.
Grow up!
Bin Ismail
February 11, 2010
@Justin
Even if your bias is ignored, your logic unfortunately cannot be overlooked. Along the timeline of history, almost every nation, at one stage or the other has faced recession and humiliation. To infer from this that during these phases, the respective deities of these communities ceased to exist, would not seem rational. The Ottoman Empire was not the first to fall. King Solomon’s empire fell and so did the Roman empire. An empire is a mundane entity. Its existence or inexistence proves neither the existence nor inexistence of God.
Please “grow up” and be more rational and specific in your criticism.
Justin
March 6, 2010
Hello Bin Ismail
Did I ever claim that the Christian god exists? I might have been born in a Christian family, but I no longer retain the idiotic, imported from the deserts of Middle east Semitic faith anymore.
Your logic would have worked had I been a believer in any kind of deity. Look there is no proof of the exiatnce of any of the billions deities that people have believed in since the past 200,000 years of our existance on this plannet.
To believe that allah or yahweh exist you have to believe the following, that for 195,000 years of our existance heaven watched as humans died due to child birth and sickness and disease and did nothing. Then suddenly about 4,000 years back God decided to intervene in human affairs and that too in the bronze age Palestine where most people could not even read.
Not in China or India where people could read and write.
Look you talk about rationalism and then you want your God allah to take responsibility for all the imploding galazies and the millions of stars out of which our own star is going to implode in about few millions years. Some designer and some design huh!
It is you who needs to grow out of such childish fables and accept the facts.
Bin Ismail
March 8, 2010
Dear Justin,
It’s comforting to realize that we agree on, at least, one issue – that the other one needs to grow up. I see that you are indeed a firm believer – in atheism. No offense, but firm atheists can be as dogmatic and judgmental as a Mullah, Priest or Pundit. Atheism has its own clergy. Now let’s take your logic and try and figure out things.
1. You evidently are not happy about Christianity having come “from the deserts of Middle East”. Would you have been more comfortable if this faith originated from the Gobi Desert on Mongolia?
2. I submit that my logic was based on the assumption that you did believe in some deity. Your firm belief in atheism does change the line of argument.
3. “…heavens watched as humans died…” How does this reflect on God’s inexistence? If humans were immortal and eternal, would you believe in God? As I see it, the Creator so designed life, so programmed it, that it was to be mortal. And there has to be some immediate cause of death.
4. God didn’t suddenly choose to intervene. Man took a while to reach the level where he could receive Divine revelation. I’m sure it took you, too, a while before you started going to school.
5. “…not in China or India…” Ever heard of Lao Tze, Confucious, Krishna, Rama and Buddha.
6. The Universe was made to exist for a specific amount of time, following which it will cease to exist. If an engineer builds a structure that is meant to live for 20 years, that does not disprove the existence of the engineer who preceded the structure.
By the way, may I respectfully remind you that the agenda is “Say no to State Religion”.
Regards
Bin Ismail
March 8, 2010
@Justin
Sorry. The agenda is “Ghazwatul Hind”.
Regards
Justin
March 17, 2010
>>>>>>It’s comforting to realize that we agree on, at least, one issue – that the other one needs to grow up. I see that you are indeed a firm believer – in atheism. No offense, but firm atheists can be as dogmatic and judgmental as a Mullah, Priest or Pundit. Atheism has its own clergy. Now let’s take your logic and try and figure out things.
lol, yes Atheism can be dogmatic as well, however I like to think of myself as freethinker rather than as a dogmatic person since I don’t stick to a particular set of irrational beliefs like believing talking snakes or burning bushes or prophets flying on donkeys or were they winged horses.
To me Atheism seems like a position that I feel sounds logical. To think of an imaginary friend in the sky who no one expcept a few mad men have commited to speak with sounds pretty illogial.
>>>>>>>>2. I submit that my logic was based on the assumption that you did believe in some deity. Your firm belief in atheism does change the line of argument.
Nice shot! even though it is flawed my dear. Atheism is not a belief system. Atheists only say that there is no reason to believe that a deity exists since there is hardly any proof for the same.
There has not been a single argument in the favour of theism that has not been destroyed. In any case there has not ever been a proof of the existance of any deity. None of the billions of deities whose existance has been believed in by mankind.
Finaly, my friend, even if there is a god, how do you know that your god allah is the one. What is Zeus was a real or if yahweh was real. I guess you would be in a pretty bad situation then.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>3. “…heavens watched as humans died…” How does this reflect on God’s inexistence? If humans were immortal and eternal, would you believe in God? As I see it, the Creator so designed life, so programmed it, that it was to be mortal. And there has to be some immediate cause of death.
You don’t get the logic. What I was trying to say here, which you could not understand, is that it is foolhardy to believe that a deity that had created (supposedly by creationists like you) human beings atleast 200,000 years ago, just left then to die of disease and famine for a better part of those 200,000 years without bothering about them.
I am not sure if you can understand what I am trying to tell you, but I will post it all the same.
>>>>>>>>>4. God didn’t suddenly choose to intervene. Man took a while to reach the level where he could receive Divine revelation. I’m sure it took you, too, a while before you started going to school.
lol, now that is precious. 195,000 years is a littlle while and all those human who might have existed during that time are condemed to hell. What a loving deity.
By the way the onus of giving the supposed divine revelations were on the creator and not the created.
How could the created know any better?
>>>>>>>>5. “…not in China or India…” Ever heard of Lao Tze, Confucious, Krishna, Rama and Buddha.
tao Tze never claimed to be a prophet, nor did Cuonfucious, Rama was probably a mythical subject and he supposedly was a god, the avatar of the god visnu, same goes for krishna.
Buddha totally denied the existance of a maker. You should know what you are talking about before you post. I could go on with Buddha and fill the entire comments section.
Perhaps you don;t know that Buddha or Sankhya Muni was an atheist. Buddhism does not even believe in the concept of an immutable soul.
>>>>>>>>>>6. The Universe was made to exist for a specific amount of time, following which it will cease to exist. If an engineer builds a structure that is meant to live for 20 years, that does not disprove the existence of the engineer who preceded the structure.
Are you saying that all powerful god happens to be a pscho who creates something inoder to destroy it, or are you claiming that the pscho god happens to have a penchat for killing people. What is the point creating something if you have to destroy it in the end.
the engineer’s analogy is supeflous and let me tell you why. An engineer does not create something because he wants to to lasts for only a short period of time. Do you think that the creators of architectural wonders of Parthenon had a specific frame of mind while creating those.
The answer is no, every artist wants his creation to be imortal. Sadly the laws of nature don’t allow that to be and it has nothing to do with god.
>>>>>>>>>>>>1. You evidently are not happy about Christianity having come “from the deserts of Middle East”. Would you have been more comfortable if this faith originated from the Gobi Desert on Mongolia?
Well that was just for effect 🙂
However the reason why I don;t believe in that there was ever a Jesus of Nazareth is bcos there is hardly any proof of his existance. Now if I were to live my life on an illusionary charater then I would come in the category of fools. Now that is certainly not desirable, is it.
Bin Ismail
March 18, 2010
Dear Justin,
Since the x-axis of this space keeps on reducing with a new reply, I’ll stick to the basic points:
1.Literalism has made many verses of many scriptures sound irrational. The element of metaphorical expression is very much employed in all revealed books. Also, sometimes dreams and visions of prophets are expressed verbatim, leaving it to the reader to employ his rationality and interpret from them. For instance, the winged horse of the spiritual flight of Muhammad, should be examined as part of a vision he had and not as a physical flight into space. The Quran clearly testifies to this.
2. Prophets, before they make their claim as prophets are known widely as sane and honest people. Since their spiritual experiences are unique to them and not shared widely, and since they call for reform, which nobody is particularly fond of, they face opposition. If someone with sight, were to land in a town of blind people, and started to warn them of impending dangers which the blind majority is obviously unaware of, the majority would indeed think of him as mad.
3.God did not create man to destroy him. Creating something with a specific life-time and destroying it are not exactly the same things.
4.I hope you’re not looking for Jesus’ fossil or DNA sample. Proof, in the study of history is seldom based on laboratory findings. Historical evidence is a form of palpable evidence too, and its abundance makes it all the more valid.
5. While some consider Lao Tze, Confucious and Buddha to be mundane philosophers, there are others who believe that they were prophets appointed by God. God has been communicating with His chosen ones, in all times and places. With the passage of time their status of a Divine appointee is frequently modified to one of a philosopher.
Regards
Justin
March 18, 2010
>>>>>>>>>1.Literalism has made many verses of many scriptures sound irrational. The element of metaphorical expression is very much employed in all revealed books. Also, sometimes dreams and visions of prophets are expressed verbatim, leaving it to the reader to employ his rationality and interpret from them. For instance, the winged horse of the spiritual flight of Muhammad, should be examined as part of a vision he had and not as a physical flight into space. The Quran clearly testifies to this.
Are you saying that the verses in the scriptures are not meant to be literally. WOW! I am sorry but most Muslims would disagree with you. Same goes for the Bible Thumpers. Excuse me but what is written in the so called holy books is either the word of God or it is not. Now if god is communicating to his so called creation, he better not speak in parables and be straight about what he wishes to say. That is the standard observation of all those who believe, the koran and the bible to be literal words of god. By the way, you are discrediting the scholars of Islam who througout history have taken the Koran literally, that includes your prophet.
>>>>>>>>>>2. Prophets, before they make their claim as prophets are known widely as sane and honest people. Since their spiritual experiences are unique to them and not shared widely, and since they call for reform, which nobody is particularly fond of, they face opposition. If someone with sight, were to land in a town of blind people, and started to warn them of impending dangers which the blind majority is obviously unaware of, the majority would indeed think of him as mad.
lol, another gem. I am too familar with all these arguments. I have been debating religious people over the last five years. My latest debate was with the fellow who Baptised me. Look, it is pretty simple to understand. Most of these so called Prophets were charlatans who wanted fame and power and they got it by invoking god. Look at the life of any professed prophet, I mean any prophet. Whether in the OT or your prophet and see what they did in their lifetimes and read their biographies critically and you will come to the same conclusion as I have.
>>>>>>>>>>3.God did not create man to destroy him. Creating something with a specific life-time and destroying it are not exactly the same things.
What difference does it make, now or 5 billion years from now. If not me then maybe one of my descendants will be destroyed due to the wrath of your god and for what?
>>>>>>>>>>4.I hope you’re not looking for Jesus’ fossil or DNA sample. Proof, in the study of history is seldom based on laboratory findings. Historical evidence is a form of palpable evidence too, and its abundance makes it all the more valid.
Jesus fossils cannot be found and even if they are it would almost impossible to find his lineage. No I am talking about vality of the gospel writers who claim to have seen him. Besides there are no secular sources that claim a person of this name ever existed. Ofcourse if you count out Joesphus, whose’s work was pilagarised badly by fifth century Coptic priests there is no evidence that he ever existed.
>>>>>>>>>>>5. While some consider Lao Tze, Confucious and Buddha to be mundane philosophers, there are others who believe that they were prophets appointed by God. God has been communicating with His chosen ones, in all times and places. With the passage of time their status of a Divine appointee is frequently modified to one of a philosopher.
First of all Buddhism and Confuciansim just like other Eastern philosophies don’t believe in prophethood. These people themselves didnot make the claims of being prophets, so who are these others to make claims that these people didnot make for themselves. I hope you are getting my drift!
CIOA 🙂
Bin Ismail
March 19, 2010
@justin
1. Metaphor is a mode of speech and an eloquent one. Humans have employed this method to communicate. What you’re suggesting is that this privilege is not accessible to God.
2. Your claim that prophets were charlatans, is in itself a whimsical claim, and presented in a very dogmatic fashion too. This is what happens to most atheists. Atheism invariably becomes a religion in itself and atheists tend to evolve into dogmatic clerics and crusaders. In your relentless effort to get rid of religion, you my freind, have become ‘religiously’ atheistic.
3. It is ironical indeed that those called fundamentalists are the first to deviate from the fundamentals of Islam. These so called fundamentalists take a line of reasoning that supports violence. Atheists, then, as scavengers feed on the words and actions of these fundamentalists, because this suits them perfectly.
4. The concept of prophethood or messengership, if not maintained with conceptual clarity, tends to undergo metamorphosis. Messengers become philosophers and sages and revealed teachings get to be known as wisdom.
5. Institutionalised priesthood and politicised clergy have always promoted departure from rationality and adopted violence, for political purposes. These tend to become the favorite references for atheists.
6. May I respectfully point out that the most classic prototype test-case of a system based entirely on atheism was the former Soviet Union.
Farewell
sandeep
March 17, 2010
if you are talking about logic
all religious books including kuran can be proved illogical. all religions are illogical. wake up dude.
you are leaving in 21 century. educate yourself.
now if you Muslims try to destroy others by force
you will also get destroyed because Allah has bestowed non Muslims with more atom bombs and military power. now war will not be fought by sword but by mind. . if you try to invade India. you will also be washed out of this earth India and Pakistan is having enough atom bombs to destroy each other. if a country will remain peaceful then more trade will be there with other countries. more trade will be there more money will be there. more money will be there then militarily country will be more strong because it can invest money for defense and research for new weapons.
if Pakistan will remain economically weak
and you people keep believing on this nonsense then you will not progress economically intellectually and you will not able to defeat anyone.
i believe personally that for winning others no need of force
love is enogh
Bin Ismail
March 18, 2010
@sandeep
I fully agree that sanity must prevail – and on both sides of the border. I also believe that a claim to monopoly over sanity is in itself not a very sane thing. Not just South Asia, people the world over must learn to be both sane and humane.
Justin
March 18, 2010
Sandeep for peace to come, religion has to go. Religion is deeply divisive and make a human hate his fellow human being.
Rana
February 3, 2010
Hi,
I Belive this Hadis is true, as all the media in world is supporting zionist …against Muslims
Pakistan is rising once again, if its not broken in 50 years ..no body can in next 5 million years InshAllah,
Justin. why do u fear?
just wait for 13 more years you will see every thing!!!
then ill ask u who is behaving like mamals!!!
Justin
March 6, 2010
Yes I am scared because I know that some crazy nutcase like you might be out over there ready with a bomb to explode and go to heaven and get his virgins.
You go on to threaten me with with your post. This is how religion retards a person and you a a good example of that.
“Pakistan is rising”, what a joke. Do you know that more than 60% of Pakistani babies are born stunted. The number of mentally unstable in your country is amogst the world’s highest. Almost 95% of Pakistani women are sugjected to domestic abuse and you claim that Pakistan is rising.
Grow up mate, ranting won’t help you. Economics and clear thinking will. Stop hating humanity and yourself.
Justin
March 6, 2010
You say that Pakistan has not been broken in the past 60 years or 50 years. Remeber a part of your country called East Pakistan?
Shame you for being such a dumb person.
Bin Ismail
February 5, 2010
In the days of the Holy Prophet, the name “Hind” was applicable to all South Asia. What is now Pakistan, was in the days of the Prophet called Hind. Prophecies made by prophets are not like weather forecasts or predictions of astrologists. Their fulfillment can be full of surprises. The Rah-e-rast and Rah-e-nijat operations of the Pakistan Army against anti-Pakistan militant mullahs can well be categorised as Ghazwatul Hind. The prophecy of the Holy Prophet has thus indeed come true.
Khullat
February 5, 2010
@Bin Ismail
Whether the Rah-e-nijat Operation is the ultimate fulfillment of the reported prophecy of Ghazwatul Hind, I don’t know. What I do know is that if any Jihad is needed today, it is needed and desperately needed against religious fanaticism.
Bin Ismail
February 8, 2010
If anything, this ghazwa of Rah-e-nijat needs to be extended to the whole of Pakistan. The blood of 3000 of our valiant soldiers cannot be allowed to go in vain.
Abdullah
February 9, 2010
Assalam-o-aly kum
Zaid Hamid ke tamam followers say mera sawal hay kay chalo hum mantay haen kay ye ahadees bilkul authentic haen in ahadees par bohat say ulma nay baat kee barahay meharbanee mera sawal hay kay mujhay sirf is bat ka jawab day daen kay Zaid Hamid kehta hay kay Allah kee qasam Ghazwa tul hind sirf Pak fauj ka naseeb hay kay aap logon nay un hadeeson ko ghor say para?
aap phir paren un ko aur Zaid Hamid ka dya hua link hee day raha hoon
http://www.ghazwatulhind.com/
jee to in ahadees maen saaf likha hay kay baytul muqqdas ka badsha hind kee janib lashkar rawana karayga aur phir fatah kay baad Baytul muqaddas ka badsha in khazano ko baytul muqaddas kee tazeen-o-araeesh kay ley istama karay ga ab ye to takreeb aap sab hee jantay hongay kay sahryat ka rule hay kay malay ghaneemat par haq un ka hee hota hay jo jang maen hissa laen aur malay ghaneemat us hee mulk ya saltanat maen jata hay jahan say fauj atee hay ab agar ye pak fauj ka naseeb hay aur pak fauj hind fata karaygee to malay ghaneemat Pakistan maen ana chahey na kay baytul muqaddas jana cahye aur agay hadees maen hay kay jab wo fauj sham kee taraf paltaengay to Hazrat Eisa a.s. ko payngay to agar ye Pak fauj hogee to woto Pakistan maen paltaygee zahir hay inssn wahan hee palat ta hay jahan say wo ata hay aur palatnay ka lafz use hee anay ka bad kya jata hay warna lafz istamal hota kay jab wo fauj sham may jaygee to Eisa a.s. ko paygee laykin nahee alfaz haen jab wo sham maen paltaygee to Eisa. a.s. ko paygee ab Pakistan aur hindustan to ye raha saath saath aur sham kitna door hay kya Zaid kee bat in ahadees par utartee hay kay Allah kee qasam ye ghazwa sirf Pak fauj ka naseb hay? jawab zaroor dijyga
Bin Ismail
February 10, 2010
@ Abdullah
Agar ijaazat ho to aap kay Urdu irshaad kay jawaab mein, Urdu mein hee kuchh arz kar doon :
#1. Iss mauzoo par aksar ahaadees say pata chalta hai keh Ghazwatul Hind ka ta’alluq aanay waalay Hazrat Eesa say hay. Aik aur hadees mein Ghazwatul Hind ka ta’alluq Imam Mehdi say bataaya gaya hai. Lihaaza wo waali ghazwa to Hazrat Eesa aur Imam Mehdi kay baghair naheen hogee. Hazrat Eesa kay baaray mein Sahih Bukhari mein aik hadees hai keh “yada’ul harb”, yaani wo harb aur jang o jidaal ko tark kar day gaa. Iss say to yeh samajh mein aata hai keh yeh jang hathhyaaron kay bajaai dalaa’il ki jang ho gee.
#2. Jahaan tak Pak fauj ka ta’alluq hai, Pak fauj iss waqt bhee aik taareekhi ghazwa mein masroof hai, jiss ka naam hai “Rah-e-Nijat”. Hamaaray jawaan mulk ko zaalimon say nijaat dilwaane kay liyay bharpoor jihad kar rahay hain. 3000 sipahee iss raah mein shaheed ho chukay hain. Yeh bhee aik lihaaz say Ghazwatul Hind hai, kuoonkay Rasoolullah (SAW) kay waqt mein “Hind” ka lafz pooray Barre Sagheer kay liyay istimaal hota thha, aur aaj ka Pakistan Huzoor(SAW) kay zamaanay kay Hind mein shaamil thha.
#3. Agar Zaid Hamid sahib ko India kay khilaaf jihad karnay ka itna hee shauq hai, aur khoonraizee say abhi jee naheen bhara, to khud kyoon naheen zehmat farmaatay.
Khullat
February 11, 2010
@Bin Ismail
India ki fikr kya karni ? Zaid Hamid Sahib, agar jazba-e jihad say itnay hee sarshaar hain, to razakar kay taur par, apni khidmaat aaj hee Pak Fauj ko paish karain, aur Operation Rah-e-Nijat mein hissa lain. Uss kay baad auron ko naseehat karain.
Abdullah
February 12, 2010
Assalam-o-alaykum
@bin ISmail
meray bhaee aap ahadees ka matlab apnee marzee say nahee nikaal saktay barahy mehar sirf aik hadees ko parkar matlab na akhaz kar lya karren kyonkay aakhree zamany maen jahan Eisa a.s. kay anay ka zikr hay to us maen wazhe ye alfaz haen kay Hazrat Imam mehdee Hazrat Eisa a.s ko jang kee qayadat sonpna changay to Eisa a.s. kahengay kay nahee janga intazam aap hee sanbhalen maen sirf dajjal ko qatal karnay aya hoon
doosra aap jo Pak fauj kay Rah-e-nijat ko Ghazwatulhind say mila rahay haen to meray bhaee Pak fauj konsa us malay ghaneemat lay kat batul muqqdas kee tazeen-o-araeesh kar rahee hay? is rahe nijat kay ley kis batyul muqaddas kay badsha nay Pak fauj ko bheja hay is tara ahadees say apnay matlab may meanings nikalna intahaee ghalat hay aapko is tara say nahee kehna cahye baysahak Pak fauj bohat qurbaniyan day rahee hay laykin apnay hee aik offiecre(musharaf) kee ghaltyon ka khamyaza bhugat rahee hay aur agar wo qurbanee bhee day rahee hay to iska ye matlab nahee kay unko khirajay tehseen paish karnay kay ley aap kisee hadees ko apnee marzee kay meanings pehna kar aisee bat kardaen
bat bohat lambee ho jaygee mukhtasaran meray kehnay ka matlab sirf yehee tha kay Zaid Hamid jhootee kasmaen kha kha kar logon mutassir karta hay aur apnay agenday par logon ko chalana chah raha hay is hadees ko istamal karkay aapka mashwara theek hay agar wo itna hee sacha mujahid hay to jakar un pak fauj kay bahadur jawano ka sath day
Bin Ismail
February 12, 2010
@Abdullah
Aap kay irshaadaat kay jawaab mein arz hai keh :
#1. Ahaadees ka matlab apni marzi say naheen balke aik ziyada mustanad hadees ki roshni mein tajweez kar raha hoon. “yada ul harb” wali hadees Bukhari mein hai aur ziyada mustanad hai, aur iss wajah say doosri ahaadees par haavi hai. Iss hadees ka matlab hai keh Eesa jang o qitaal ko tark kar dain gay.Iss mein ishara iss baat ki taraf hai keh Islam ki nishat-e-saania hathyaaron kay zaryay naheen hogi.Phir kiss tarha hogi ? Ussi tarha jiss tarha hamaisha say haqq jeeta hai, yaani apni daleel aur apnay husn kay zore say.
#2. Pak Fauj kay ‘aik afsar’ naheen ‘do afsaron’ ki ghalatiyan aaj saamnay aa rahi hain. Gen Musharraf say pehlay aik Gen Zia bhee guzray hain. Bahrhaal ye maazi ki baatain hain. Aaj hamari fauj, mazhab kay naam par dehshatgardi karnay waalay zaalimon ka, muqaabala barrhi jurrat say kar rahi hai. Aap ki rai ka ihriram karta hoon laikin apni rai par qa’im hoon.
#3. Agar log Zaid Hamid ki qasmon say mutassir ho rahay hain to yeh faisala to logon nay karna hai keh ahaadees ki kiss tashreeh ko qubool karna hai. Uss tashreeh ko jo Rasool-e-kareem(SAW) ka Rahmatun lil aalameen hona sabit karti hai, ya iss kay baraks kissi tashreeh ko.
Bin Ismail
February 12, 2010
Let us not unnecessarily drag this debate to make Zaid Hamid appear like a ‘worthy of talking about’ thing. There are many around who are virtually committed to painting an image of Islam as a war-mongering religion and an image of the Holy Prophet as a pro-war leader. The fact is that the Prophet was the greatest Peace-maker known to mankind. He withstood the fiercest persecution in Mecca for 13 years with absolute patience and without any confrontation. Then on Divine directive he migrated to Medina. The authorities of Mecca took the lead in declaring war and even then the Prophet did not engage in combat until God told him to. Certain orientalists try untiringly to paint a war-mongering image of the Prophet with the obvious intention of defaming him. To add fuel to the fire, some Muslims somehow end up contributing to this defamation campaign.
Nusrat Pasha
February 12, 2010
The Holy Quran aims at inculcating in its reader and follower an attitude of tolerance, accommodation and acceptance with complete and absolute religious freedom for all. The Quran is in its very mood and attitude a ” Peace Mongering ” scripture. The following references deserve attention :
1: ” There is NO coercion in matters of religion. ” (2:256 )
2: ” Whoever chooses to believe LET him believe and whoever chooses to disbelieve LET him disbelieve ” (18:29)
3: ” Permission to fight is given ONLY to those against whom war is waged, because they have been wronged ” (32:39).
4: ” Your religion is for you and my religion is for me ” (109:6)
Abdullah
February 13, 2010
Assalam-o-alay kum
@Bin Ismail
mehar banee hogee agar aap us hadees ka poora hawala bata daen ke konsay page par hay kis bab maen hay maen itnee arabic to nahee janta lakyin “Yad” arabic maen hath ko khetay haen aur “Harb” jang ko doosra jo aap khe rahay haen kay Hazrat Eisa a.s. jang ko tark karngay to jinab aisay alfaz nahee balkay ye hay kay jab hazrat Eisa a.s. ayengay aur dajjal ko qatal kar dangay to aur saleeb ko tor dayngay aur phir Islam har ghar maen dakhil ho jayga aur jizya bhee khjatam ho jayga kyonkay jab har koee musalman hoga to jizya kis say langay aur itnay achay halat hongay kay koee zakat lenay wala na hoga aur ye baten bhee saree mustanad ahadees kee haen meray bhaee aur aap mujhay zaroor batayga hadees ka page no waghera ya aap us hadees ko likh hee dain is post par hawalay kay sath to maen samajh sakoon maen koi alim nahee kay har hadees maree nazar say guzree ho to aap barahay mehar banee wo hadees likh daen aur doosra mujhay hayrat hay kay aapnay Pak fauj kay Rah-e-nijat ko aik tara say ghazwatulhind qarar day dya aap apnee bat par qaeeem haen un ahadees maen ye alfaz to kaheen nahee kay hind kay andar hee say log jang karengay bahir say anay walay deshat gardon say ya baghawat karnay walon say balkay baytul muqaddas ka badsha hind kee janib lashkar bhejayga ab maen kya keh sakta hoon agar koee apnee bat par ar jay to kya kay jaskata hay jabkay Pak fauj kee bahadree say mujhay ikhtalaf nahee aur maen un jawano ko khirajay tehseen pesha karta hoon jo jurrat ka muzahira kar rahay haen wo pooree dunya kay ley misal hay laykin iska ye matlab nahee kay maen unko itna bara doon kay Zaid Hamid kee tara ghazwa badar kay Sahaba r.a. kay barabar qarar day doon Allah kay wastay humaen ab hindoo walee thinking say nikalna chahye ye unkee soch rahee kay cow unhe doodh detee thee to uno nay usay poojna shuroo kar day darakht unhay phal detay thay to unhay poojna shuroo kar dya har cheez ka aik maqaam aur uskee jaga hay usko waheen tak rakaha jay baraya na jay jesay hamaray hee chand alim walyon ko itna bara detay hane kay Allah tak unka maqam pohancha detay haen jis cheez ka jitna maqam hamaray mazhab nay mutayan kar dya humaen us say agay nahee barana chahye meree bat ka bura mat manyaga..
Bin Ismail
February 13, 2010
@Abdullah
# 1. Aap ki khwahish par hawaala paishe khidmat hai :
(Sahih Bukhari, Kitab ul Anbiyaa, Baab Nuzool Eesa ibn Maryam). Agar aap poori hadees parrhain, to yeh waazih ho jaai ga keh Eesa ab hathyaaron waali jang tark kar dain gay. YADA UL HARB say murad hai keh wo jang ko tark kar day ga. Aik aur hadees jo Tabraani mein darj hai, mein alfaaz hain keh YADA UL JIZYA, yani wo jizya laina tark kar day ga. Dono hadeeson ko aik saathh parrhain to samajh mein aata hai keh jab jang hee tark ho jaai gee to jizya aur maal-e ghaneemat bhee naheen liya jaai ga.
# 2. Gustaakhi muaaf, laakin aap ki soach aur Zaid Hamid Sahib kay khayaalaat mein itna hee farq hai keh aap ki tashreeh kay mutabiq Baitul Muqaddas ka badshah Barre Sagheer par hamla karay ga, aur Zaid Hamid Sahib ki tashreeh kay mutabiq Pak Fauj India par hamla karay gi. Aap dono buzurg Ghazwatul Hind ki aysi tashreeh kay qa’il hain jo Muslim/Ghair Muslim jang ki soorat mein ho. Maira mauqaf yeh hai keh, iss waqt sub say barrha khatra khood Musalman askariyyat pasand mullaon ki taraf say hai, jin ka muqabla aaj Pak Fauj barrhi umdagi say kar rahi hai. Qadr dani aur parastish mein farq hota hay. Mein hargiz yeh naheenkeh raha keh yeh wahid taabeer hai iss hadees ki. Asl ghazwatul Hind to Eesa aur Imam Mehdi ki pairvi mein daleel kay zaryay hogi.
# 3. Filhaal to mashwara hai keh aap apni tashreeh kay mutabiq, Baitul Muqaddas kay badshah say kissi khair ki ummeed na rakhain, kyoonkeh Baitul Muqaddas ka badshah Israel ka vazir-e azam hai.
# 4. Aap nay apna mauqaf bayan farma diya hai, aur mein nay bhee apni guzarish paish kardi hai. Ab munasb hoga keh hum iss behs maulviana andaz mein mazeed tool na dain.
Wassalam.
Abdullah
February 14, 2010
meray bhaee manay ye kab dawa kya kay main baytul muqaddas kay badsha kay intazar maen hoon asal haqeeqat to yeh hay kay Zaid hamid say pehlay manay ye hadees apnee pooree zindagaee main na paree na sunee thee doosra ye kay mera kehnay ka matlab ye tha kay jo Zaid Hamid kehta hay zara uskay followers un ahadees ko hee ghor say par laen to bat samajh maen ajatee hay jo Zaid kehtyya hay wo in hadeeson sday bilkul hat kar hay teesra ye kay ye hadees kis tara pooree hogee Allah behter janta kay muslims baytul muqadas ko wapis lay laengay aur yahan hind-o-apk kay kyaa halat hongay kay phir badsha ye lashkar bhejayaga agar ye ahadees poreee nahee huee to aur wesay bhee abhee to is hee par behas horahee hay kay ye ahadees authentic haen ya nahee teesra aapnay kaha kay Qdaran danee aur poojnay maen farq hota hay to meray bahee Qadar danee mane ye nhee hota kay aap rah-e-nijat ko aik tara say ghazwa tul hind qarar day do aur agar aap shirk jis qisam ka bhee hua us kee jar tak pohancho to wo shuroo maen madah saraee tha Hazrat Nooh a.s. kee qom bhee jin teen buzrugon par shirk karnay lagee thee unkee shuru maen qadar danee aur aqeedat hee thee jo bartay baertay shirk tak ja pohancha isee ley hamaray mazhab maen zayad madah saraee ko pasand nahee kya gaya balkay is kee mamaniyat hay aur aap jo keh rahay haen kay islam ko is waqt sabsay bara khatra muslim askaryat pasand mullaon kee taraf say ha aap yahan khud hee confuse haen kyonkay jo dehshat gardee karengay aur bay guna musalmano ko marengay wo musalman mullah nahee ho saktay haan unkay roop maen ho sakta hay aur agar koee musalaman molana aisa kar raha hay to meray bhaee uskay peechay waja kay hay kya kabhee us waja ko jankar uska ilaj kya gaya??
maen na to India par hamla karnay ko kehta hoon balkay maen to kehta hoon is waqt sabsay pehlay zarrorat hay apnay amaal drust karnay kee
aur meray bhaee ye jo jizya aur jang ko khatam karnay wali bat hay ye jab hoga jab sab musalman ho jayngay har ghar maen islam dakhil ho jayga jis par Allama nay sher bhee kaha
gaya wo dor kay chup kar peetay thay peenay walay
banay ga sara jahan may khana har koee bada khuar hoga
aur aap agr ye sabit karnay kee koshish kar rahay haen islam aman ka mazhab hay is maen jang o jadal nahee to islam bilkul aman ka mazhab hay laykin jihad bhee hamaray deen ka hissa hay jihad bisef laykin Zaid Hamid jesay log jab jihad ka ghalat istamal kartay haen to afsos hota hay
aur aik sawal yahan apsay karta hoon baqol apkay hazrat Eisa a.s. jang ko tark karkay dalaeel say mamlat tay karegay to kya dajjal dalaeel say eeman lay ayga ya dalaleel say hee mar jayga?
weasy aap say guzarish hay kay aap mera coments par laen www. azzab.com par mera hee name say jo manay bohat tafseel say likhe haen meree soch kesee hay aapko andaza ho jayga kyonkay aapnay mujhay Zaid hamid jesa qarar dya hay siway aik point kay
Bin Ismail
February 14, 2010
@Abdullah
Mairay Bhai. Mujhay yehi andaisha thha keh kaheen hamaari yeh behs ” maulviana” rang na ikhtiar kar lay. Maulviana andaz say mushaabihat bhi khaufnaak lagti hai. Mujhay aap ki rai ka poora ihtiram hai. Mairee zaati rai ka khulaas yeh hai :
# 1. Asl takmeel, agar is paishgoi ki koi hai to wo Imam Mehdi kay zaryay hi hogi.
# 2. Zimni takmeel ki soorat mein Rah-e nijat bhi aik muqaddas jang hai, kyoonkay Deen kay sab say barrhay dushmanon, yani Mullaon kay muqabil par hai.
# 3. Imam Mehdi jang aur harb ko irshad-e-Rasool kay mutabiq tark farma dain gay. Islam ki nishat-e sania jang kay bajai amn say hogi.
# 4. Zaid Hamid ki rai say mujhay bahrhal ittifaq naheen.
Maira khayal hai keh ab iss mauzoo par mazeed waqt sarf na kiya jai. Aur bhee gham hain zamaanay mein…
Khuda Hafiz
Abdullah
February 21, 2010
assalam-o-alay kum
@Bin Ismail
meray bhai agar aap meree ray ka ehtram na kartay lekin hadeeson ko apni marzi kay meanings na pehnatay to khushee hotee main apko har giz jawab na deta laykin aap koi na koi bat aisee kar jatay hain ke mujhe jawab dena parta hay
1) apnay kaha kay agar ye peshan goi durust hay to ye imam mehdi kay zareey hogi jinab agar ye hadees waqai pooree hogee to is main ye kaheen nahee likha kay ye Imam mehdi ke zareeye poori hogai balkay jab ye lashkar paltay ga to hazarat Eisa a.s. ko payga to apko apni taraf say ye bat karnay ki qatan zaroorat nahee
2) apnay deen kay sabsay baray dushman molano ko kaha apkee zehniyat dekhey agar aik doctor zalim ho aur mareezon kay gurday nikal kar bechna shuroo kar day to ap doctors kay paishay ko bura nahee keh saktay wo insan ghalat hay doctree nahee isee tara agar kisee nay mulla ka roop dhar kar islam ko badnam karne kee koshish kee to aap us se agay bar gay aap to mulla lafza ko itnay haqeer andaz main istamal kar rahay haen
ab kitnay fauji officers kay baray main sharabo kabab kay qissay mashoor hain aur un main haqeeqat bhee thee to kya main tamam fauj ko zani kehna shruoo kardoon astaghfirullah nahi bilkul nahi kyonkay isee fauj main kitnay hee log deen par amal karnay namazee parhez gaar hain aur zayada tar log achay hee hain to main itna tang nazar nahee ho sakta kay aisa kahoon aur word fauj ko tehkeer say istamal karoon
aur apnay jo kaha kay ghazwatulhind Hazrat Eisa a.s. aur Imam mehdi kee pairwee main hoga to jinab pairvee kay lughwee meanings takleed kay hain Aap s.a.w kee sharyat kay bad ab kisee aur kee pairwee nahi karnee aur apkee itla ke ley arza hay kay Hazrat Eisa jab ayengay to imam mehdi imamt karengay namaz kee aur aap jallul qadr payghambar honay kay ba wajood unkay peechay namaz parengay maqsood ye hoga kay aap koee naee sharyat nahee layngay balkay Aap s.a.w. ke pairee karengay (ye aik tara say us ehad kee takmel bhee hogee jo Allah myan nay alamay arwah main tamam payghambron say lya tha kay agar tumnay apnay zamanay main Muhammad s.a.w. ko paya to tum unkee pairwee karo gay) aur Hazrat Eisa a.s. Aap s.a.w. kay ummatee kee haysiyat say wagfat payngay apnay jo kaha kay wo jang aur jizey ko tark karengay to Apa s.a.w ke taleemat qayamat tak kay ley hain aur uskay qawaneen bhee tabdeel nahee hongay haan ye zaroor hoga jizya khatam ho jayga wo is ley kay jab har shakhs musalman hoga to jizya kis say lya jayga aur zahir phir jango jadal bhi kis say hoga ap apnee ghaltee ko durust karen
aur agar aap qayadat kay bajay lafz pairwi likh gay hain to tab bhi aap ghalat hain kay un ahadees say kaheen sabit nahee hota kay us lashkar kee qayadat Imam mehdi ya Hazrat Eisa a.s. karengay haan jab wo lashkar paltay ga to Hazrat Eisa a.s. ko payga
aik tarah say apnay hadees ka mazak uaraya hay ye keh kar kay baytul muqdas ka badsha israeli hay mera eman hay kay agar ye hadees authentic hay aur isnay poora hona hay to Allah kay ley kuch mushkil nahee kay wo baytul muqqdas par musalmano ko ghalba ata farma day aur phir wahan say lashkar aye is hadees ko poora karnay
main apko jawab na dayta kaykin aap nay mujhay majboor kar dya tha ab meree aapsay guzarish hay kay meray coments par koee jawab mat dijyag warna mujhay majbooran jawab dayna parayga kyonkay aap koee na kaoee aisee bat kar daetay hain kay main majboor ho jata hoon to ye meri guzarishg hai kay jawab naa dain
Bin Ismail
February 21, 2010
@Abdullah
Hazrat-e naasih gar aa’ain deeda-o dil farsh-e rah
Hum dono har baar koi na koi aisi baat kar daitay haih, jiss kay nateejay mein doosra jawaab dainay par ‘majboor’ ho jata hai. Hum dono ki ‘majboori’ qaabil-e deed bhi hai aur qaabil-e rehm bhi. Ab aap kay taaza irshadaat kay hawaalay say ‘majbooran’ arz hai:
#1. Hadeeson ka apni samajh kay mutabiq tashreeh karnay ka jitna qusoorwar mein hoon, shaayad utnay hee aap bhi hain. Ihtiyaat farmaayaay, marz-e maulviat ki ibtidaai alaamaat mein say yeh bhi hai keh ikhtilaaf-e raa’i bardaasht naheen hota.
#2. Mulla, fauji aur doctor kay hawaalay say jo aap nay farmaaya hai, uss taqaabul mein ghalati aap yeh farma gaey hain keh fauji ya doctor jab qusoor karta hai to apnay taur par karta hai. Mulla jab zulm karta hai to Khuda aur Rasool kay naam par karta hai, aur apnay zulm ka jawaaz deen ko thhehraata hai. Iss liyay mein nay kaha thha keh aaj Deen ka sub say barrha dushman Mulla hai.
#3. Imam Mehdi ki ‘pairvi’ ka tasawwur agar aap ko pasand naheen aaya to mat keejiay ga. Hum kar lain gay. Azeezam, pairvi ka matlab hargiz yeh naheen hota keh Rasool kay muqaabil par pairvi. Choonkeh Mehdi Naib-e Rasool hongay, iss liyay un ki pairvi bhi pairvi-e Rasool ki wajah say hogi.
#4. Yeh jo aap ka khayal hai keh Imam Mehdi kay waqt mein ‘har shakhs musalman hoga’, to mairay bhai aap Mehdi say aisay mojazay ki tawaqqo kyoon rakkhtay hain jo khud Rasool-e Khuda say zaahir na ho saka?
Ghazwatul Hind kay baaray mein aap apni rai par qa’im rehyay. Yeh aajiz apni rai par qa’im hai. Zehmat dehi kay liyay maazirat khwah hoon.
Qaasid kay aatay aatay khat ik aur likkh rakhoon
Mein jaanta hoon kya vo likhain gay jawaab mein
Aik martaba phir Khuda Hafiz.
ibnqassim
March 3, 2010
Your doubts on the authenticity of hadiths are silly.Hadiths are classified as sahih,hasan,weak and maudu based on some principles and a science,its not based on who lived when.
Secondly the part about pakistanis capturing india in ghazwatul hind is nothing but propaganda by pakistani nationalists using religon as a pretext.The hadith never mentions about pakistan infact 70% of pakistan is what can be called hind.The hadith talks about pious muslims who can be anyone conquering india.
Thirdly the part about it being already fulfilled is a weak opinion as some of those hadiths talk about isa ibn maryam(pbuh) and dajjal at the same time.now no one other than qadianis believe that prophet isa has already come.
Bin Ismail
March 5, 2010
@ibnqassim
#1. Your words: “Your doubts on the authenticity of hadiths are silly.Hadiths are classified as sahih,hasan,weak and maudu based on some principles and a science,its not based on who lived when.”
I don’t suppose anyone would disagree with you on that.
#2. Your words: “Secondly the part about pakistanis capturing india in ghazwatul hind is nothing but propaganda by pakistani nationalists using religon as a pretext.The hadith never mentions about pakistan infact 70% of pakistan is what can be called hind.The hadith talks about pious muslims who can be anyone conquering india.”
This careless propaganda is not by Pakistani nationalists. It’s the work of Zaid Hamid – as if there was still a stone left unturned in the campaign to project Islam as a violent religion.
Just as Ghazwatul Badr does not mean a ‘battle against Badr’, similarly Ghazwatul Hind cannot mean a ‘battle against India’. Ghazwatul Hind could best be translated as ‘the battle of India’. Today’s Pakistan, was in the days of the Holy Prophet, very much part of Hind. This is a point, that I too, have tried to put across earlier on this very blog. Obviously, the Prophet could not have meant Hind fighting Hind. As far as your point about ‘pious Muslims’ is concerned, piety is a relative attribute – pious compared to the relatively impious. Now, other than the Devil himself who could possibly be more impious than those who spill blood in the name of Allah and Rahmatun lil aalameen? Think about it. At the moment the Pakistan Army is engaged against an army of militant and violent Mullahs, who are responsible for depriving thousands of innocent people of their lives, relatives and homes. Even if Operation Rah-e Nijat is not, in the most literal and precise sense, that very Ghazwatul Hind that was prophesied by the Prophet, yet in a strictly metaphorical sense, this can be termed the Battle of Hind [Hind of the Prophet’s time], to the extent that it is taking place within the geographical limits of what was known as Hind in the days of the Prophet, and is indeed being fought against the most impious of people. So, if not in the primary and literal sense, there does appear to be a secondary and figurative fulfillment.
#3. Your words: “Thirdly the part about it being already fulfilled is a weak opinion as some of those hadiths talk about isa ibn maryam(pbuh) and dajjal at the same time.now no one other than qadianis believe that prophet isa has already come.”
Regardless of how anyone chooses to interpret the prophecy about the advent of Eesa ibn Maryam, one thing is for sure, and I have argued this earlier on this blog, that according to a hadith of Bukhari, Eesa will abandon combat and war. The words are YADA UL HARB, meaning he will cast aside war. If Eesa ibn Maryam is to cast aside war, then the believers of his time too, would be obliged to do the same, because it would not be permissible for pious Muslims to engage in war while the prophet of the age discards war. Now logically, if there is to be a holy war, under the auspices of Eesa ibn Maryam, while he has banned fighting himself, it would be right to conclude that the prophesied Ghazwatul Hind would not be a war of weapons. If not by weapons, then what? It would appear logical to conclude that, in view of all aspects of the prophecy, the foretold Ghazwatul Hind would be fought and won by superior logic. Let us not forget, that contrary to the claims of certain orientalists, as well as some Muslim scolars such as Maudoodi Sahib, the true single weapon of the Holy Prophet was neither the sword nor the spear – it was his all-encompassing love and his compassion, which won the hearts of Arabia and reaches out to our hearts today. Eesa ibn Maryam, who anyway would be inclined to turn the other cheek, too, would follow the same path of love and compassion.
ibnqassim
March 15, 2010
To Bin ismail,
your words”Regardless of how anyone chooses to interpret the prophecy about the advent of Eesa ibn Maryam, one thing is for sure, and I have argued this earlier on this blog, that according to a hadith of Bukhari, Eesa will abandon combat and war. The words are YADA UL HARB, meaning he will cast aside war. If Eesa ibn Maryam is to cast aside war, then the believers of his time too, would be obliged to do the same, because it would not be permissible for pious Muslims to engage in war while the prophet of the age discards war. Now logically, if there is to be a holy war, under the auspices of Eesa ibn Maryam, while he has banned fighting himself, it would be right to conclude that the prophesied Ghazwatul Hind would not be a war of weapons. If not by weapons, then what? It would appear logical to conclude that, in view of all aspects of the prophecy, the foretold Ghazwatul Hind would be fought and won by superior logic. Let us not forget, that contrary to the claims of certain orientalists, as well as some Muslim scolars such as Maudoodi Sahib, the true single weapon of the Holy Prophet was neither the sword nor the spear – it was his all-encompassing love and his compassion, which won the hearts of Arabia and reaches out to our hearts today. Eesa ibn Maryam, who anyway would be inclined to turn the other cheek, too, would follow the same path of love and compassion.”
Though you as an individual have every right to have you own opinions but i would like to mention that either you have not thoroughly studied the hadiths concerning the second advent of Isa ibn maryam(pbuh) or you are deliberately ignoring the hadiths.
Firstly all the hadiths concerning the advent of prophet Isa are of mutawatir status and they are very much clear concerning his arrival i.e during the peak of Dajjal’s dhulm.The hadiths also mention his killing of dajjal and his followers at a place which is in present day Israel.Now even the most leniant logic would fail when it comes to israel.Secondly the part of his abandoning war will most obviously take place after the battle with dajjal and the breaking of the cross(hadith).
thirdly,As for our prophet being rahmatul alameen.There can hardly be any muslim who can deny this but what most muslims conveniently ignore is that he is also the “prophet of war” or “prophet of slaughter”(hadith).Islam being a religion of fitrah has provisions of war and the situations of war are a means of test for the believers.So as muslims there is no reason for us to be apologetic regarding this side of our religion for war and peace are both part of human history and will forever be so,for the world will never stop giving out people like hitler or bush who can only be stopped by war.
Fourthly regarding the ghazwatul hind,i very strongly disagree with your logic of badr.Ghazwatul badr meant the war that took place in badr and similarly ghazwatul hind would mean the war that would take place in hind.Even though a large part of pakistan is what can be called hind but still nearly 90% of hind is what is india today.Being an indian muslim myself and based on what am witnessing today i.e rapid radicalization and militarization of the hindu community and experiments such as the massacre in gujrat and other localized massacres which regularly take place in india and the openly stated claims of hindu fundamentalists who by any standards are most brutal and severe in opposition to islam(even bohras were killed in gujrat for there resemblance to muslims) and most importantly the clawless attitude of successive governments to these forces combined with the increasing reach of these forces,it is with despair i see my country being turned into a huge graveyard for muslims.And if at all they decide to turn whole of india into gujrat(which they themselves say will) i fail to see how any battle of logic can prevail.Though war is what we hate but in the current situation it seems inevitable to the survival of muslims in subcontinent.
Hope i clarified my points.Take care…ma salam
Bin Ismail
March 15, 2010
To ibnqassim,
Thank you for recognizing my right to my opinion. In case you’ve not noticed, the Prophet’s words “yada ul harb” meaning ‘he (Eesa) shall abandon fighting’ is not anybody’s opinion, it happens to be the Prophet’s prophecy. The Messiah is, in light of this prophecy, destined not to fight.
The Prophet was forced into defensive combat. He was left with no other choice. It would not be right to introduce him primarily as a war-maker. Such casual remarks will only amount to fortifying the stand of anti-Islam Orientalists. Prophets Musa (Moses), Daud (David) and Sulaiman (Soloman) all were forced to go to the battle feild – but none was a war-mongeger. With respect to Islam, the following conditionality must pre-exist prior to taking to the battle feild:
” Permission to fight is given ONLY to those against whom war is waged, because they have been wronged ” (32:39)
This condition certainly was true in the case of the Prophet, but to apply it to all Muslims living in India, would be a gross misstatement. India has most certainly not declared war against its Muslim citizens – no way. I agree that the condition of Muslims in India does indeed defy India’s claim to secularism, but certainly does not justify armed struggle. In any case, if the Muslims of India sincerely choose to follow in the footsteps of the Prophet, their first choice should be ‘sabr’ or patience, as the Prophet did in Makkah, the next option would be migrating from their homeland, as the Prophet did.
You have noted with keenness certain ahadith – although I do not agree with your interpretation – but did not notice the word of God. Allah says twice in the Holy Quran “IDFA BILLATI HIYA AHSAN” [Quran 23:96, 41:34] meaning”repel by means of ultimate goodness”. Muslims should keep these words of Allah before them. Evil should be combated with goodness.
You’ve said, “I fail to see how any battle of logic can prevail”. With all due respects, what I fail to see is where anybody has taken any trouble to fight the battle of logic, unless if you consider the ongoing suicide bombings in Pakistan a ‘battle of logic’.
I respect your opinion, but in all honesty differ.
Best Regards
ibnqassim
March 16, 2010
TO bin ismail,
Same here,our opinions are not words of Allah(swt) that its unconditional,to you yours and to me mine.
As regards to an armed uprising by muslims in india,i never said thats desirable but i believe that is something inevitable.Militant hinduism has no place for other religions specially Islam who they see as having converted their akhand bharat muslim nations.only time will tell how true my concerns are but sabr by no way means letting our mothers raped on the streets of india.Islam has given provision to fight against aggression and is considered a lofty deed in doing so.As regards migration,that is something very few can really accomplish and most importantly there is no wisdom in losing the little that we already have,even when the prophet migrated to madina,it was all a temporary arrangement,the rest is history.
Logic after all is a personal inclination and most importantly nothing but blood and bones have bought changes in this world,human history is a living testament to that.As long as evil resides in the world,truth will have to battle it out for its survival.
Peace to all those who follow guidance.
khuda hafiz
Justin
March 18, 2010
Dear Kassim, like the prototypical Islamist Jihadi you keep on ranting without providing any facts.
Who are these so called Hindu fanatics who are making these plans.
The problem is that you are basically speculating based on what you hear in the media. A vast majority of Hindus are so just for the heck of it. In most cases most of them don’t even believe in religion. A similar strain of Christians and Muslims is also growing up.
Other than in Gujrat can you tell me of a single incident where Muslims were at the recieving end of Hindus and I will give you multiples incidences where Hindus and Christians were at the recieving end of Muslims, in INDIA.
Growup and stop living in your fantasy world.
Most of the RSS chadis are middle aged and old men who need to wake up thrice in the night to take a leak. RSS and VHP hardly has any youth carde, so who exactly is going rape your Muslim mothers and sisters.
You people have been supressing minorities in your countries since the last 60 years. Today a non-muslim in Pakistan can’t aspire to be anything big in his life and you have the nerve to accuse India of having a genocidal agenda against Muslims.
Shame on your!
Bin Ismail
March 16, 2010
Dear ibnqassim
May I humbly submit:
1. Hindu extremism and militancy, if anything, only proves that Jinnah’s perceptions were correct. I suppose we have to thank them for taking the trouble to vindicate Jinnah. But if Hindus have opted to take the course of violence, does that justify Muslims to behave in a way that belies the very basis of Islamic teachings- Peace?
2. There are efforts in progress the world over to depict Islam as a religion of violence, and the Holy Prophet as a war-mongerer. Books, chronicles, articles, caricatures and what not, all trying desperately to prove to the world that Islam is a creed of intolerance. When Muslims too start talking in the same language, they unintentionally end up strengthening the hands of these anti-Islam lobbies. I fail to see how this serves Islam.
Aren’t there enough contributors to bloodshed worldwide already? Why can’t Muslims aspire to contribute to peace?
3. When the Holy Prophet migrated from Makkah to Madina, it was most certainly for good. Even after the fall of Makkah, he returned to Madina, died there and is buried there.
4. In all the ghazwaat, which essentially were defensive campaigns of the Holy Prophet, spanning over a decade, the total number of human lives lost on either side, collectively does not exceed 2000, of which 1300 were the aggressors and 700 were defending Muslims. The collateral damage alone during the recent US strikes on Iraq, on a single day exceeds this. The total figures are horrific. Talk about the blessings of blood and bones.
5. All I can say is that Muslims in India will have to exercise more prudence. You don’t have to make it a point to fall headlong each time a trap is set for you.
Khuda Hafiz
Justin
March 18, 2010
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>1. Hindu extremism and militancy, if anything, only proves that Jinnah’s perceptions were correct. I suppose we have to thank them for taking the trouble to vindicate Jinnah. But if Hindus have opted to take the course of violence, does that justify Muslims to behave in a way that belies the very basis of Islamic teachings- Peace?
Hindu extremism is something that is a very recent phenomena. As a child growing up in Kerela I don’t remeber knowing any radical Hindus. The precise reason behind Hindu radicalization are the constant attacks by monotheists who don’t accept any worlview other than their own. There is no historical record of Hindus subverting minorities in history.
My family for example has been Christian since the last 600-700 years. Throughout these centuries the only times we faced discrimination and attacks was when the Muslims ruled over Cochin or for that matter other parts of India. Being Orthodox we were also attacked briefly by the Catholic Protugese. I can’t recall a single incident in which any Hindus attack us throughout our history.
Muslims on the other hand have wrecked havoc on India since 1947. The Moplah riots, the massacres of Parbhani in Bihar, direct action day in Calcutta, killing tribal Christians in the states of Assam and West Benagl. There are numerous examples of Muslim terrorism before Hindu extrimist even existed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>2. There are efforts in progress the world over to depict Islam as a religion of violence, and the Holy Prophet as a war-mongerer. Books, chronicles, articles, caricatures and what not, all trying desperately to prove to the world that Islam is a creed of intolerance. When Muslims too start talking in the same language, they unintentionally end up strengthening the hands of these anti-Islam lobbies. I fail to see how this serves Islam.
Do you think it is all hooplah. No it is not. The earliest sources of Islam, which are the Koran, the Hadith (all sahih hadiths), and the Sira point towards one thing, that Muhammad was a warmonger and much more than that. You are still worried about improving the image of Islam. For that you would have to wipe out centuries of Islamic barabrism and continuity of the same barbarism in today’s day and age.
You would have to do away with the history that been recorded by no other than Muslims. Go and read the biography of your own prophet criticaly and then come back and tell me about it.
The problem with people like you is that you pick and choose what you wish to believe. Most people like you don’t even bother to read what is written in their own holy books.
>>>>>>>>>3. When the Holy Prophet migrated from Makkah to Madina, it was most certainly for good. Even after the fall of Makkah, he returned to Madina, died there and is buried there.
There was lot that happened between that, remebr Khyber, and the gwazas in which he wiped out the three Jewish tribes.
>>>>>>>>>>>4. In all the ghazwaat, which essentially were defensive campaigns of the Holy Prophet, spanning over a decade, the total number of human lives lost on either side, collectively does not exceed 2000, of which 1300 were the aggressors and 700 were defending Muslims. The collateral damage alone during the recent US strikes on Iraq, on a single day exceeds this. The total figures are horrific. Talk about the blessings of blood and bones.
Would you like it if more would have died? exactly how many body counts does it take for you to satisfy your blood lust? Look you have to use your imagination and think as to how much influence Mushammad yieleded in those intial days and how much landmass he could cover in his lifetime. Plus what would the population 7th century desert Arabia have been with its limited resources and refuently mortality rates.
Bin Ismail
March 19, 2010
Dear Justin,
Why does your logic lead me to believe that you are still a “child growing up in Kerala”? No offense, but History evidently was never your favorite subject. Your ignorance of Hindu radicalization and your simultaneous bias and pre-conceived notions about the Holy Prophet of Islam speak volumes about your intellectual ability to engage in objective discourse. I’m afraid, with the amount of prejudice that afflicts you, objective analysis and rational discourse may never become your cup of tea.
The point I was trying to politely put across, and which did not exactly require a genius to fathom, was that the much-talked-about battles of the Prophet, spread over a period of 10 years, had a total casualty [both sides put together] of about 2000. In contrast, the case I presented as a comparison, which I now realize did require a genius to fathom, was that an equivalent number of Iraqi innocent civilians were killed in one day, as a collateral damage. Sorry, I forgot to mention the impressive death toll of Muslims in Gujrat and Kashmir at the hands of “non-radical and yet-to-be-violent Hindus”.
Since you most evidently have a problem with “deserts”, specially those of the 7th century, I could recommend a 7th century forest for you.
Farewell.
Nusrat Pasha
March 16, 2010
I’ve said this earlier. It may be worthwhile to repeat that the Holy Quran aims at inculcating an attitude of tolerance, accommodation and acceptance with complete and absolute religious freedom for all. The Quran is in its very mood and attitude a ” Peace Mongering ” scripture. The following references deserve attention :
1: ” There is NO coercion in matters of religion. ” (2:256 )
2: ” Whoever chooses to believe LET him believe and whoever chooses to disbelieve LET him disbelieve ” (18:29)
3: ” Permission to fight is given ONLY to those against whom war is waged, because they have been wronged ” (32:39).
4: ” Your religion is for you and my religion is for me ” (109:6)
ghazwatulhind
January 25, 2011
Answer to all the questions put in this blog are answered well at
Answer to Myth of GhazwatulHind
haroon sheeraz
April 28, 2011
bilkul jhoota article hai deoband mulla type logon ki bat ka kya bharosa wo to hindu hain jinhon ne pak ko tasleem hi nahin kya shroo se love to zaid hamid pakistan zinda bad yeh article kisi indian agent ne likha hai
THE ASWAD'S
May 4, 2011
WHEN PROPHET(PBUH) WENT TO TAIF FOR SPREADING THE MESSAGE OF ISLAM.THE PEOPLE OVER THERE STONED HIM UNTILL HIS BOOTS WERE FILLED WITH BLOOD. ALLAH SENT HAZRAT GIBRAEL ,WHO CAME TO PROPHET (PBUH) AND ASKED THAT IF HE(PBUH) ORDERS THE MOUNTAIN OF TAIF WOULD BE SMASHED OVER THE TOWN. BUT THE PROPHET(PBUH) PRAYED TO ALLAH TO SHOW THE RIGHT PATH TO THOSE PEOPLE AND BRING FORTH SOME ONE FROM THEIR BLOODLINE WHO COULD PROTECT YOUR RELIGION. MOHAMMAD BIN QASIM WAS FROM TAIF AND WAS THE REASON FOR THE ADVENT OF ISLAM IN SUB-CONTINENT. PAKISTANS IDEOLOGY IS BASED ON ISLAM .THE COUNTRY WAS MADE IN THE NAME OF ISLAM . IT IS THE ONLY ISLAMIC NUCLEAR POWER. ITS FIGHTING BOTH AMERICANS IN AFGHANISTAN AND TACKLING INDIA . ………….ITS MY OPINION , BUT THINK ABOUT IT ……..
Itimad Raja
June 14, 2011
I have read some comments and am shocked at some of you. Since when did religion work around the siha sitta. As for the person who wrote this article he is very deceptive and all of those who accept it are being blinded by there absurd understanding of the truth. I will point out just 1 flaw the poster says Imam Nasai collection is not part of the siha sitta and he was born way after the imams. That’s a lie imam dhabi and others considered imam nasai on the level of imam bukhari even ahead of imam muslim. But in the general sense his collection is ranked third and that is agreement among the ulema. Anyway the rankings are like this bukhari, muslim, nasai, abu dawood, ibn maja or muwatta of imam malik there is a difference of opinion on which one should come 6th ibn majah or the muwatta. Personally I think these rankings don’t mean much if a hadith is found in any of the collections which is sahi, hasan or daif and is supported through different chains of transmission they are accepted. Its a complex subject but in dumbed down version and one way it is used is if a hadith is sahi or hasan and found in nasais collection and also found in non siha sitta books and is daif if its in conformity with the hadith then it is accepted. Same is vise versa. Pakistan zindabad salam everybody
Ali
August 4, 2011
The quote of Quiad e Azam is mentioned here on top of ur web page, this is basically rule of ISLAM …. Islamic state gives security to all citizens regardless their cast, creed and Sect. plz read abt Madina state where all citizens were traeted treated equally and plz refer lto ast Message of prophet at Hajatul Widah.
Nabeel
October 8, 2011
Assalam-o-Alikum,
Considering the reward mentioned in hadith for participents of the war, we should keep in mind that there are very rare wars about which Holy Prophet has anounced such great awards. The only war we see in the past, about which Holy Prophet has said that each and every participant of that war will go to heaven is Ghazwa-e-Badar. In which muslims were against their own relatives (son of hazrat Abubaker said to his father after he accepted Islam, “Father durin the war of Badar you came under my sowrd but I didn’t harm you”. Hazrat Abubakar replied, “I you would have killed you if you had come under my sowrd”) and it is very hard to fight against people you know.
In the past there has been no such war fought in this reigon between Muslims and non-Muslims which was worthy of such reward (Muhammad Bin Qasim came with 1200 army which was a normal attacking number for Muslim army at that time. Tariq Bin Ziad also attacked Spain with 12000 army. Musa Bin Naseer also used same number under his command. After that all the wars fofughts before Pakistan were for the sake of Rule. They were not about Muslims or non-Muslims.
So i dont think if it has already happened.
Above most of the ulama views qouted about this Ghazwaare from India. And what the Indian Muslims felel, result is easy to withdraw from Muslim genocides in Gujrat. Furthermore, mostly they blame Muslims for all terrorist attacks, even when they are having very strong freedom movements undergoing in 17 Districts. So Muslims are always scared of such kind of events.
Asad
September 9, 2012
Ghazva-tul-Hind is very very true..!!
http://www.ghazwa-e-hind.com/ (FOR References)
Prayatna
July 3, 2013
What if Dajjal falls from its donkey?
http://sanandhonline.blogspot.com/2013/07/what-if-dajjal-falls-from-its-donkey.html
katwa
November 10, 2013
Bollocks
Muhammad Hamza saleem
May 20, 2014
Zaid hamid is true..because Hazrat naimat Ullah shah said the same thing about 850 years ago..SO can u please logically prove that NAimat Ullah is wrong” This is just a propaganda. These hadees are true.
Shaban
August 17, 2014
It is so unfortunate that most people have gone to the two extremes when dealing with the ‘Hadiths of Prophet Mohammad (saws). One declares belief in each and every hadith of the Prophet (saws), without confirming whether the hadith is authentic or not! The other extreme declares their complete opposition and rejection of any and all ahaadiths, regardless of whether they are fabricated or not!
The true muslims must take a balanced view or the ‘middle way’ when dealing with anything.
Some great and eminent scholars have spent their entire lives and done an exhaustive research and investigation in each of the hadiths to determine their authenticity, and only when they were completely satisfied, they recorded these hadiths in their ‘Sahih’ or Book of Authentic Hadiths. The most respected and accepted collections came to be recognized as the ‘Sihah Sitta’ or the ‘Six Authentic Collections’ of hadiths. These eminent scholars of hadith investigated each aspect of the saying or deed whether it was in conformity with the Quran or not, for it is inconceivable for a believer to assume that the Messenger of Allah (saws) would have done or said anything against the dictates of the Quran. Then they thoroughly checked and investigated the chain of narrators to see whether they were truthful people or not, or whether one who claimed to have heard it from the other was alive at the same time or not, and if alive, did they ever meet each other or not! If there was even a slight doubt in any event or chain of events, these eminent scholars refused to accept the hadith as authentic.
Even after all their exhaustive efforts and thorough investigations, it is impossible to claim, nor does anyone ever claim, that each and every hadith in their collection of ‘sahih’ is absolutely authentic; for after all, this is a work of man, and man is prone to shortcomings and error. For the believers, the only guaranteed authentic Book of Guidance has to be the Glorious Quran, whose authenticity is guaranteed until the end of time by none other than Allah Subhanah. For every aspect of guidance, ’emaan, belief, faith, ‘aqeedah’, ‘tawheed’, ‘shirk’, etc., one need not look beyond the Quran. The hadiths, once they have been declared authentic by the scholars, will only be used when one finds the Quran silent on a particular subject.
Now regarding the Hadith of Gazwah hind, Imam Bukhari (may Allah’s blessing be on him) did mention it in ‘Al Tareekh Al Kabeer’.
As far as Zaid Hamid is concerced we all know he is being funded to keep his mouth piece moving, and was the Khalifa of a false prophet Yousaf Kazzab. It is interesting to know that the Taliban on the other hand also apply this Hadith on a larger scale Pakistan along side India, as there was no Pakistan at the time of Prophet SAW.
The world is devided into two blocks now, either you with us or against us, one block is the enemies of Islam and the other is Islam. Pakistan army is fighting the crusades war, so makes them on the other side of the fence.
عن أبي هريرة قال وعدنا رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم غزوة الهند فإن أدركتها أنفق فيها نفسي ومالي فإن أقتل كنت من أفضل الشهداء وإن أرجع فأنا أبو هريرة المحرر
Hazrat Abu Huraira :anhu: says “Rasool Allah :saw: promised us Ghazwat ul Hind, so If find it, I will spend my life and wealth in it, if i get killed I will be from the best of Shaheeds, and If I return safely I will be “Freed Abu Huraira” (from hell)”
And for those saying the time has passed , the follwoing hadith gives a better picture,
It is related to Hazrat Abu Hurairah(R.A) that Hazrat Muhammad(P.B.U.H.) talked about Hind & said:
“Definitely, one of your troop would do a war with Hind, Allah would grant success to those warriors, as far as they would bring their kings by dragging them in chains / fetters. And Allah would forgive those warriors (by the Blessing of this great war). And when those Muslims would return, they would find Hazrat Isa Ibn-e-Maryam(A.S.) in Syria (Shaam)”.
So this is one of the reasons the Taliban fighters are also travelling to Syria..
For all, Allah knows best.
sta
September 19, 2014
Operation Zarb-e-Azb, the ongoing Pakistan-Taliban War is “Ghazwatul Hind”.
Khan
September 20, 2014
@ sta
//..Operation Zarb-e-Azb, the ongoing Pakistan-Taliban War is “Ghazwatul Hind”..//
Well said – and the Taliban represent the anti-Islam forces. Who could possible be a greater enemy of Islam than the Mulla? Good luck Pakistan Army! May you win this war.
Ali Ahmad
March 9, 2015
i really like this article. i search many time this type of article, thanks for sharing this.
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Ajay
November 20, 2015
Salaam Walekum to everyone, Its very heartening to see positive & logical voices from Pakistan, a country I’ve always believed to have all the ingredients of a good nation but sadly, dominated & misled by displaced ideals of their leaders.
Ghazwa-tul-hind to an Indian Hindu is certainly not like Akhand Bharat, which means united India from Afghanistan to Burma. However, political divisions make this dream a bit difficult to achieve but please also understand, Akhand Bharat is not a millitary conquest, its a March for Unity in terms of brotherhood, peace & liberty. We are not sure what the real political order in Ashokas time between the kingdoms in present day Afghanistan & Pakistan was. Inshallah we’ll achieve it by realising common virtues of our great religions & that of Humanity.
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